More on the Trademark Policy
Tuesday, April 1st, 2008 at 7:50 PM by: catherinelindenThank you for all your feedback over the last week. I’ve read your comments, seen your blog posts, gotten lots of emails and hear your frustration with the new trademark policy. I know many of you feel it’s confusing and I’d like to spend some time talking about the policy and why it matters to both Linden Lab and to you.
So, why are trademarks important?
When Linden Lab puts the Second Life or Linden Lab name on a product, we are standing behind it. Our reputation rides on that product. We want you to use “SL” and “inSL” and to wave your affiliation proudly, but we need to make sure the context is clear that you’re not Linden Lab.
Why did Linden Lab decide to update the trademark policy now?
We were getting lots of questions from Residents about use of our trademarks and we realized it was time to do a better job of communicating. In the new policy, we’re much more specific about the ways to show your affiliation, and we hope that helps answer the questions we’ve received.
Does the policy affect copyrights in the content I create?
No, you still retain copyrights in the content you create. That hasn’t changed. The trademark policy isn’t about that. For the difference between copyrighs and trademarks, see the explanation here and here. And, if you’re a content creator, stay tuned. We’re taking steps to improve our copyright claim process and will saying more about that soon.
I also wanted to address your top questions about the new policy.
1. Can I use the Second Life Eye-in-Hand logo in a press story?
Yes! If the story is about the Second Life world, you can use the logo in the body of the story. You can’t, however, use the logo to identify your blog — why? Because it looks like you’re a Second Life or Linden Lab vetted project. You can read more about this here.
2. Can I discuss the Second Life world on my website?
Of course! You can — and should — call our products and services by their names. For instance, it’s ok to say you’re “running a business in the Second Life world” or that you bought “Linden dollars through the LindeX exchange.” You can read more about that here.
3. Can I use SL with my product, domain or organization name?
Yes, under our special license to use “SL.” You can use “SL” with your own trademark. So, if you own the “Dell” trademark, you could call your presence in the Second Life world “Dell SL.”Or, you can use two common nouns with “SL.” For instance, SL Ballet is not ok (only one common noun) but SL Ballet Troup works. And SL China Portal is not ok (”China” is a proper noun), but SL Chinese Residents Association works. You need at least two common nouns so others don’t think you’re an “official” Second Life organization or website. Read more about this license.
4. What if I have a domain name that uses “SL” with only one common noun?
We’ve given you 90 days to transition to a new domain name that works with our special license. If you need additional time, please write us at tm-licensing@lindenlab.com and we’ll consider giving you permission to extend the 90 days or to forward the old domain name to your new one. For more on submitting a licensing request check out the FAQ.
5. I’ve got more questions, who can I ask?
We’ll be glad to help you. You can email us at tm-questions@lindenlab.com with specific questions. Keep in mind there are MANY of you and only a few of us, so please be patient.
We’ve given you 90 days to make changes. Please use that time to read our policy and ask any questions. If we see after 90 days that you’re not in compliance, we’ll let you know.
Finally, in an earlier post Robin introduced our new Communications Manager - Katt Linden - who started yesterday. Katt will be focusing on our Resident communication channels including this blog and the forums to make sure we’re using the right tools to communicate clearly and frequently with the community. She’s going to need some ramp up time so please be gentle. 
Thank you again everyone for your feedback! I hope you find this helpful.
April 1st, 2008 at 7:56 PM
So transitioning a web domain name - does that mean LL will compensate those who have to fork out real money for registration of a new name - and paying web developers and graphic designers to re-do work??
This after-the-horse-has-bolted approach is going to have a detrimental effect on a number of active and useful sites I’m sure.
April 1st, 2008 at 7:57 PM
I understand you position on the trademark, What I do not understand is you “allowing” us to use a cheap, second rate scrap of graphics. You should be ashamed!
You have a world full of talented people at your fingertips! If you can not provide something of quality, allow us to choose our logo! Or must we do it without you?
April 1st, 2008 at 8:01 PM
Hmmm… I still have major issues with the “SL” part of it. I use two: “SL Review” and “SL Attitude” I’ve decided my “SL” doesn’t stand for “Second Life”. The other trademarks and logos I understand.
My issue is with the initials “SL”.
Hmmm… I’m just a nobody with a couple blogs nobody reads. So I guess I’ll just wait for the cease and desist letter and weigh my options from there.
Honestly - I really do understand what you are trying to do and support you in it. But I also figure in the case of “SL” - you’ll look at things on a case-by-case bases. I figure you’re all human, too. LOL
April 1st, 2008 at 8:14 PM
This is thoroughly unhelpful. It simply does not clarify anything. You say we can discuss the “Second Life world” on our blogs. Why do we have to add “world” after what, under US trademark law, is nominative fair use?
Does Linden Lab intend for the Terms of Service to apply to Resident actions taken out-of-world, on third party websites? Will you be enforcing the ToS for speech that is permitted under nominative use? These are the kinds of questions that must be answered, and this “clarification” does nothing to move us toward greater understanding.
April 1st, 2008 at 8:16 PM
This is thoroughly unhelpful. It simply does not clarify anything. You say we can discuss the “Second Life world” on our blogs. Why do we have to add “world” after what, under US trademark law, is nominative fair use?
Does Linden Lab intend for the Terms of Service to apply to Resident actions taken out-of-world, on third party websites? Will you be enforcing the ToS for speech that is permitted under nominative use? These are the kinds of questions that must be answered, and this “clarification” does nothing to move us toward greater understanding.
April 1st, 2008 at 8:19 PM
To me, SL is only an acronym for SecondLife that arose from the residents. To further that, The Sims Online hasn’t trademarked TSO. World of Warcraft hasn’t trademarked WoW. To me, this skirts the very fine line of common use….hold on, let me get a coke.
Now, supposing my name was Shelly Long, and I am a public figure, and I have a blog called SLblog..what then. Are you to slam a lawsuit on me for that?
For the above reasons, I don’t think that will hold up in court.
Oh, what’s to happen to SLExchange, Second Life Herald, SL Universe, TalkSecondLife? Seems to me that they were well established long before Linden Lab took thier stance now.
/me goes to change her name to Shelly Longstocking.
April 1st, 2008 at 8:19 PM
This is thoroughly unhelpful. It simply does not clarify anything. You say we can discuss the “Second Life world” on our blogs. Why do we have to add “world” after what, under US trademark law, is nominative fair use?
Does Linden Lab intend for the Terms of Service to apply to Resident actions taken out-of-world, on third party websites? Will you be enforcing the ToS for speech that is permitted under nominative use? These are the kinds of questions that must be answered, and this “clarification” does nothing to move us toward greater understanding.
I support Linden Lab enforcing its trademarks. I really do. But I don’t support overreaching. The policy and its application are so vague that right now it appears to prohibit fair use or mandate speech in a particular format. I had hoped that this promised “clarification” would tell us that the policy was never intended this way. It appears I was wrong.
April 1st, 2008 at 8:21 PM
[...] More on the Trademark Policy « Official Second Life Blog Blogged with the Flock Browser [...]
April 1st, 2008 at 8:27 PM
Trade marks , copyrights, intelectual property rights all this stuff makes my head spin Second life has become real life. I am with Ari becuse i use two tiny letters an s and a l at the end of my blog url am i suppose to change that now? I just want to make my things sell them at a reasonable price to make money to buy other peoples things.Is that ok or do i need to regeister with someone to do that now. do i need to copyright my “buisness” name.
Not that any of this matters becuse for the last week 2 times a day you have put the cabash on inworld transactions and now i cant even upload textures to finsh my current project!
April 1st, 2008 at 8:31 PM
You take time do deal with all this load of poo spend all money we pay and YET “sl” was performing horrible this week people who pay you monthly to log in can’t log in!! I all of us just don’t log in one day!!! to show you that residents and the ‘’sl” blogs made you!!
may be that will let us have our “sl” in our blogs!!
April 1st, 2008 at 8:33 PM
At question #3’s answer: OMG WUT? That was insane.
April 1st, 2008 at 8:33 PM
So if I understand this, for some reason lawyers believe that the SL Ballet would be interpreted by the average person as being something that is operated by Linden Lab, but not the SL Ballet Troup. Wow. Maybe that’s pretty standard in trademark law or something, but it makes no logical sense to me.
April 1st, 2008 at 8:34 PM
I’d really like to hear the answer to this one. Doesn’t seem quite fair that someone would have to pay to change their current domain name because all of a sudden you decided to Tradmark “SL” I definitely think compensation is in order if you expect people to comply with this.
“So transitioning a web domain name - does that mean LL will compensate those who have to fork out real money for registration of a new name - and paying web developers and graphic designers to re-do work??
This after-the-horse-has-bolted approach is going to have a detrimental effect on a number of active and useful sites I’m sure.”
April 1st, 2008 at 8:34 PM
What have you all got against ballet, anyway?
This policy doesn’t clarify a few things, like must people put those pesky TMs and (C)s and (R)s all over their blog, their website, and their avatar?
April 1st, 2008 at 8:38 PM
“When Linden Lab puts the Second Life or Linden Lab name on a product, we are standing behind it. Our reputation rides on that product. We want you to use “SL” and “inSL” and to wave your affiliation proudly, but we need to make sure the context is clear that you’re not Linden Lab.”
seriously, ll have done far more than any resident to tarnish their own reputation.
April 1st, 2008 at 8:42 PM
Thank You for the clarifications Catherine.
April 1st, 2008 at 8:42 PM
i think you have more important issues to worry about, like fixing bugs and making the grid stable instead of worrying about blogs that use your hand logo.
April 1st, 2008 at 8:47 PM
Thank you for this information!
April 1st, 2008 at 8:50 PM
I say Fire your lawyers!! Go get your self a new Porsche (TM or R) after that one?
Oh and you can sue my avatas a$$ off!!
April 1st, 2008 at 8:51 PM
again I say it is amazing how Staunch Linden Labs is to Protect thier own Name, Logo, Trademark and Copywrite yet does NOTHING to Protect thier Residents from IP theft, Copy Bots, Texture Stealing applications. Further more, Protect thier Residents Company Names, Logos, Designs, DMCA & Trademarks. I for wone will be taking the Linden Labs Hands off aproach to inSL!
April 1st, 2008 at 8:51 PM
I’m going to make a new blog and call it “Third Life Minus One” - is that okay? LOL
Oh this is even becoming funny.
April 1st, 2008 at 8:51 PM
i’m glad we are keeping the real world out of second life !!!!
April 1st, 2008 at 8:53 PM
Where do we stand with ‘Hippo’ or ‘Grid’ ?
April 1st, 2008 at 8:55 PM
[...] Catherine’s current BLOB entry: 3. Can I use SL with my product, domain or organization name? Yes, under our special license to [...]
April 1st, 2008 at 9:00 PM
LOL @ #23 dont forget (waiting)…
April 1st, 2008 at 9:03 PM
“Our reputation rides on that product. ”
LAGs, CRASHes, BUGs, CHAOS - thats the current reputation…
I AM LUCKY to not have any SL “policy issues” lol
April 1st, 2008 at 9:07 PM
That’s a lot of words just to say “screw you” to the people who love SL (this stands for Seriously Laggy, so don’t sue me) enough to create a site devoted to it.
April 1st, 2008 at 9:08 PM
You know what, I’m just going to call it Second Life. I’m not going to start calling it “the Second Life world.”
coco
April 1st, 2008 at 9:08 PM
What concerns me is that it seems that you’re getting ready to float an IPO, however, your interface is forever borked. I know… Instead of using the ridiculous amount of tier fees I pay you every single month, how about you hire at least one troubleshooter to review the viewers before they’re released. Or, maybe pay some overtime to the code poets who are writing the code for the viewer so that they have enough time to finish the job before releasing it. Or, maybe… just maybe… you should concentrate on creating a reliable product and even a halfway decent customer service team, demonstrating that you care about the residents of your world. Your slogan says that it’s our world and our imagination… But, these latest rules clearly show that’s false advertising. So, if you come after me for using your name, I’ll come after you for false advertising. Then you can use my tiers for paying lawyers to answer the same type of frivolous lawsuit I would bring against you that you would bring against me. So there! *turns in a huff, stomps out of the room and slams the door*
April 1st, 2008 at 9:12 PM
There are A LOT of “SL” brands (hundrets in Germany alone) what do Linden Lags expect? That communities and companies surrender and change all their names?
I STRONGLY SUGGEST A “CLASS ACTION LAW SUIT” against Linden Lags by those who are concerned.
Nota bene: IF NECESSARY
April 1st, 2008 at 9:13 PM
look at the last couple dozen blog entries and see what reputation LL has…
if klsl.net ain`t good, feel free to refund $99USD hosting costs + $9.995 domain registration costs + $1USD paypal transfer fee to my account, if not, cya in dutch court…
April 1st, 2008 at 9:16 PM
Hmm…..so how long can we use “2L” before you decide to change the rules? ………I’m sure trademarking that will be next..I do agree that this whole after the fact approach is a bit unprofessional and LL needs to compensate the members who will have to pay out of pocket to change their domains….but the odds of that happening are about as slim as them paying us back for lost time in SL doing business due to hmm lets say asset server issues and crashing and stale money transactions and well the list goes on but Im sure we all get the idea…lets make a deal LL you guys give us hard working individuals who actually support SL a nice smooth grid to do business and interact on…drop the teen grid and give us a business grid for paying members….((possible?)) and we agree not to use your “trademark” which more than likely we created…> ((rocks back and forth in her chair waiting to rez))
April 1st, 2008 at 9:16 PM
Sometimes people get carried away and forget about common sense. What you fail to realize is that all these people who created websites and Blogs with SL in front of them gave Linden Labs a huge boost of free advertizing as well as “good community feel”. They are FANS AND LOVE YOU. If I was in charge of Linden Labs I’d fire the moron who thought that there would be a huge benefit to “Branding the SL Name”. You’re wasting a great deal of money trying to establish something that for the most part that is already established. All these SL websites can’t function unless SecondLife exists.. period. Its not like someone is going to get confused and sign up or subscribe to another game. If that WAS the case, yes I’d understand. Remember users groups? IBM user groups, Apple User Groups. All these people joined online forums to support a product they loved. The forums helped FUEL INTEREST IN A PRODUCT. Take it from me, a person who has been online before most of those in charge of Linden Labs… you are way off base.
April 1st, 2008 at 9:17 PM
CheerGirl Allen Says:
April 1st, 2008 at 8:51 PM
“again I say it is amazing how Staunch Linden Labs is to Protect thier own Name, Logo, Trademark and Copywrite yet does NOTHING to Protect thier Residents from IP theft, Copy Bots, Texture Stealing applications. Further more, Protect thier Residents Company Names, Logos, Designs, DMCA & Trademarks.”
Yes, exactly.
And also, I agree this “clarification post” did absolutely nothing to help clear things up. And yes I agree. Redo that “inSL” logo if you have any hope of anyone wanting to even use it.
Mind you, the logo itself is the least of the “inSL” problems - but that is a good place to start.
April 1st, 2008 at 9:29 PM
I can think of a couple of pitiful websites/forums that use “SL” to boost their own personal agenda and I for one am glad to see LL enforcing their trademark. Get rid of the rif raf that plagues the SL community once and for all.
April 1st, 2008 at 9:30 PM
Thank you Catherine for this follow-up. Please ignore all the uneducated neagativity by the minority of residents who do not “get it”.
LL is simply protecting their image by making sure their intellectual property is not used improperly. Stop complaining and either gain LL’s permission to use their name or be creative and change names. Many business/website/blog creators are upset because they cannot get away with capitalizing on LL’s success any longer.
Also, if you cannot see the difference in SL Ballet and SL Ballet Troupe then please use a lifeline and ask a buddy to explain it to you. …. kthksbye.
April 1st, 2008 at 9:34 PM
Does it also apply to Lindened? eg I took my car in to the shop and they Lindened it, meaning made it worse than before…
April 1st, 2008 at 9:37 PM
I have a blog titled:
The Second Life of Soledad Rosado
I have absolutely no intention of altering it in any way. Referring to a Latina woman’s existence in an alternate country is a recognized and very common use, and is obviously very common among Latin@ expatriates, many of whom have never even heard of the Second Life (R) virtual world.
This is a clear case of prior use, and is quite culturally specific. The fact that my second life actually happens in the virtual world with the same name is, IMHO, quite incidental. So, other than a disclaimer stating these facts, and commenting on SL status as a trademark, I believe myself within the letter and spirit of the law.
My product blog will of course be fully compliant with the terms as described here, since I have no reason to do otherwise.
Shame on you for trampling on common culture!
April 1st, 2008 at 9:39 PM
So it is legal for SL to ban the world from creating websites that begin with SL and a noun? How is that possible? So huge businesses such as SLExchange, and every other business and project that begins with SL has to uproot and change now?
I understand Second Life(R) and even most of the others, but I dont think it is legal to say that no one in the world can now register SL followed by a common noun. I will be contacting my lawyer about this tomorrow as I have had huge projects in the works (SLfamily.com and SLvendor.com) for over a year.
There is a lot of time and trouble involved in this.
Do you realize how much business will be lost over this. Who is going to pay for allof this rebranding?
This is a hell of a business. Perhaps we should all go out and trademark every 2 letter combination out there and tell the world they cant use it. Chrysler owns the “PT” Cruiser but my company, Pixeltrix uses the prefix PT all the itme.. Is this illegal too?
I’m not sure a company can force everyone in the world to not use a 2 letter combination followed by a noun. Thats an awefully pompous move on Linden Labs part and could possibily lead to many law suits. Especially considering that all content created in SL can ONLY be used in SL .. we can’t export our creations, so they are owned by Linden Labs, yet we cant use “SL” when refering to our projects??? How does that make any sense?
April 1st, 2008 at 9:41 PM
Well, we have to give LL one thing, no one can enrage the public quite like they can.
April 1st, 2008 at 9:44 PM
The majority of these post I agree with. I do not agree that I am “rif raf” because I have a blog (second life snippets) that I bought the domain for, paid for hosting, designed, and wrote each and every entry, took each picture and video to promote Second Life. The blog does not make money. It was created because I was a newbie ‘once’ and wanted to help others. I also wanted to show some of the great places out there - as well as showing my progress in Second Life. So how on earth is this hurting SL or how on earth can I be called “rif raf’.
I strongly believe that Linden Labs MUST look at each of these type’s of sites, blogs, before tossing us out if we do not destroy all our work. As others are saying, we have been helping, not hurting.
Jaca
April 1st, 2008 at 9:49 PM
I forgot to include this…
April 1st, 2008 at 10:07 PM
hey has anyone else noticed money keeps breaking!!!!!!! it might just be me but I’m not sure. I notice things keep breaking everyday. Dont want to confuse Sh@tLife with Secondlife
April 1st, 2008 at 10:10 PM
3. Can I use SL with my product, domain or organization name?
Yes, under our special license to use “SL.” You can use “SL” with your own trademark. So, if you own the “Dell” trademark, you could call your presence in the Second Life world “Dell SL.”Or, you can use two common nouns with “SL.” For instance, SL Ballet is not ok (only one common noun) but SL Ballet Troup works. And SL China Portal is not ok (”China” is a proper noun), but SL Chinese Residents Association works. You need at least two common nouns so others don’t think you’re an “official” Second Life organization or website. Read more about this license.
4. What if I have a domain name that uses “SL” with only one common noun?
We’ve given you 90 days to transition to a new domain name that works with our special license. If you need additional time, please write us at tm-licensing@lindenlab.com and we’ll consider giving you permission to extend the 90 days or to forward the old domain name to your new one.
———————-
Is this some sort of april fools joke?
April 1st, 2008 at 10:11 PM
I’ll have to agree with the majority of those who’ve commented on this post, how can you prohibit people from using a term that residents created? That’s like those who use the term RL; these are terms residents created to make it easier when typing, much like brb, or tyt.
I think it’s insane for you to be enforcing this AFTER the fact, if you were going to enforce this for new blogs/websites, I’d at least try to understand a bit more, but to make everyone change their domains because you feel you own rights to a term that residents themselves created, is a bit crazy.
Are you saying SLexchange, SLherald will have get rid of their domains? Are you going to reimburse us all for making these changes?
I do see a class action lawsuit headed your way, sad but true.
April 1st, 2008 at 10:17 PM
People can’t read,
QUOTE: We want you to use “SL” and “inSL” and to wave your affiliation proudly, but we need to make sure the context is clear that you’re not Linden Lab.
Not sure what the fuzz is about, people!
However the timing is as always amazing, ROFL
Sorry LL you can’t be beaten when it comes to unlucky timing, especially when everyone is already upset with the asset servers and the whole content theft thing where we are totally left alone and trying to fight dirty playing criminals without the support we need!
It is totally understandable that LL wants to make sure that John Doe is blogging as John Doe and not as part of SL (the company)
However since you got your deal straight, how about a statement an official statement that gives us an idea how you will deal with the whole IP Theft thing?
April 1st, 2008 at 10:17 PM
In reality I believe there isn’t really any legal grounds if you actually formed a company that had S and L in the main name. Second Life does not have the trademark of SL otherwise they could tell companies who own sites on sllight or slsales which have no affiliation with Second Life to move. There is a site called hpcomputer they are not a HP dealer, they sell Dell.
April 1st, 2008 at 10:26 PM
Couple of other questions:
1)has SL only been trademarked in US or is it global
2)can Catherine please follow Sidewinder Linden’s example and ANSWER SOME OF THESE QUESTIONS from the people you INVITED COMMENT FROM!
April 1st, 2008 at 10:26 PM
http://www.acronymfinder.com/af-query.asp?acronym=SL&string=exact&s=r&page=1
Well good luck with the SL thing.
April 1st, 2008 at 10:28 PM
Um… I own three domains with the full “secondlife” term in them. I will NOT be changing domains, thank you. And I have an attorney willing to back me up - already phoned him. And all three pertain to Second Life by Linden Lab. I was very clearly told you guys have NO leg to stand on, virtual or otherwise, especially since I’ve owned these domains for some time now and they are considered well-established. Sorry, LL, too little too lte guys. You cannot lay claim to “Second Life” now after several years have done by with zero defense.
April 1st, 2008 at 10:30 PM
Not even sure why you’d want to include any part of the SL logo in your product’s brand, anyway. Come on…. Come up with your own brand.
April 1st, 2008 at 10:35 PM
I suppose that there many others out there like this one that use the letters SL in some form or another.
SL CORPORATION and SL-GMS are registered trademarks of SL in the United States. SL’s graphics, logos, page headers, button icons, scripts, product names, and service names are trademarks and trade dress of SL or its affiliates. SL’s trademarks and trade dress may not be used in connection with any other party’s product or service, in any manner that is likely to cause confusion among consumers, or in any manner that disparages, dilutes, or is harmful to SL. All other marks not owned by SL or its affiliates are the property of their respective owners.
Oh and their web URL is sl.com
What about the .sl top level domain for Sierra Leone. I don’t see ANY nouns after it.
Wonder if there is anytime limit for a company that doesn’t actively protect their trade and service marks before they lose them.
April 1st, 2008 at 10:36 PM
I always thought sl stood for Susan Lucci
April 1st, 2008 at 10:36 PM
For all the years I have been around in SL™, I have to say, this was lowest point.. by forcing a community, that brought the ‘SL’ the initials to life, when you where merely ‘Second Life”, then now telling that very same community that it is wrong to use the term..
Well in short it is about as bad as Washington trademarking the initials ‘United Sates of America’ “USA” then making it so that only ‘pre-approved people’ (i.e.: special interests groups) could use the initials, with the “Presidents” or Congress’s” permission… It is just down right Corporate Tyrannical at its peak.. Shame on you Linden Labs.
I hope the “Chairman” of the board realizes this, and refines the ‘clarification’ to be something little more kind hearted to the community that keeps him sitting comfortably in that nice (Leather?) chair.
-Josh Panther/Tony Holiday/Dylin Voom
Enough Said.
-Josh
April 1st, 2008 at 10:38 PM
I am curious if Linden Labs is actually able to legally own a trademark called “Second Life” due to the common words of it.
April 1st, 2008 at 10:39 PM
In January I registered a domain name with the words “second life” in it and have been using it very actively since then. I paid several years in advance for it - meaning it will be registered under my name, address and telephone number until January 2018. So what now? Who do I contact at Linden Lab in order to receive a reimbursement check for my domain and who do I sign the domain name over to at Linden Lab? Because if I wind up getting a cease and desist order after 90 days there’s gonna be a heck of a lot of sparks flying…
April 1st, 2008 at 10:42 PM
BTW, it’s Linden Lab, NOT Linden Labs!!! Be careful… They have the right to sue you now for misappropriation of consonants.
April 1st, 2008 at 10:42 PM
“4. What if I have a domain name that uses “SL” with only one common noun?
We’ve given you 90 days to transition to a new domain name that works with our special license.”
Oh, gee, thank you oh kind one. We are truly not worthy of such generosity.
So, do I submit the domain registration bill to LL or you directly?
BTW, try responding, it’s unacceptable to post and run.
April 1st, 2008 at 10:44 PM
Dear $VIRTUALWORLDCO, you can’t *own* two of the letters of the alphabet, or any abbreviation made from them.
Repeat after me: the “brand” has NO VALUE without the very people you are most seriously smacking with this legal stupidity.
You want a real “brand” policy that respects the community that signs your checks? Simply ask everyone using a “mark” for community building, awareness, and free advertising to simply add “This site, blog, whatever, not owned or operated by $VRITUALWORLDCO or $VIRTUALWORLD.”
Done. Cancel the unnecessary. check to the lawyers and lets all get back to world-building, shall we?
@1 Not likely. After all, a lawyer would say you were “paying” for a name you didn’t “legally” own. Even if the “name” isn’t a noun at all, but an abbreviation, in the case of EssEll.
@6 A mark is only within a given “trade”, so unless Shelly Long also runs a webhosting company that serves 3D content instead of regular pages, we can assume she’s in a different trade, and can use the S and L mark within that trade without fear of molestation from $VIRTUALLAWYERS
You know, since a blog is not a 3D “virtual reality”, do trademark enforcement even count, anyway? Is blogging a different “trade” that $VIRTUALWORLDCO’s? I bet any half-awake lawyer could make that case, without smacking the $VIRTUALWORLDCOLAWYERS with unpleasantness like first amendment issues and the like.
@9 if you change anything just because they ask, you saved them the legal fees. That also helps them make their case stronger against anyone else. Why not change it to EssEll(tm ), or SLife(tm), 2ndLife(tm), SecondLives(tm), SeconfLiving(tm), SecondLifestyle(tm), SecondLoaf(tm), SecondLyfe(tm), SecondLyphe(tm), etc etc etc or any number of other combinations that explicitly show what you mean while thumbing your nose and legal ninnyhammers who can’t script, push pixels, or build, and have nothing better to do than charge everyone for doing all the real work. And if they get on your case, change it to SecondLeave(tm) or SecondLife(tm).
@12 Lawyers love to make stupidity like this seem to have merit. Just say no. L:et lawyers speak gibberish to themselves and let the rest of us stick to old-fashioned common sense. That 2 noun business is a nonsensical smokescreen. Why not ask the $VIRTUALLAW exactly what statute or precedent they are citing as a basis for that crack-addled theory. Name the statute and jurisdiction, or precedent in some form of legal venue other than “cuz we said so” and maybe the rest of us would care.
@13 there’s a reason you can’t point to a legal definition for “fair” - there isn’t one.
@14 if you add those visually trashy symbols everywhere, you only legitimize the insanity. Just say no. Law is a construct of the people, and the people together CAN decide for themselves what law should be. Lawyers only get away with this sort of garbage because we, the people, let them.
@28 good for you! My response: stop using their marks entirely. Substituting silliness like $VIRTUALWORLDCO detracts from their market, stops the word of mouth, and decreases their mindshare. Let’s see how long it takes for the vast wave of media indifference to get noticed once so many thousands of people stop giving them free viral and guerilla marketing promotion. I pay to play on the service, but they will now have to PAY me to advertise it for them Tiger Woods doesn’t wear logos for free, and neither will I, now. Enough of that and they will relent.
@29 You won’t be the only one.
@33 Lawyers routinely ignore common sense in favor of ‘pushing the theory’ or ’setting the precendent’ or just plain ‘what can we get free through intimidation.’ - that’s all the Bluster Center is about: intimidation. Pay the “license fee” or be _____ . What do I get for the fee? Use of the letters L and S.. And? *crickets* A license isn’t a product, or a service, why pay for one?
@35 how much did you get paid for that shill? And exactly how is the Brand Center supposed to get rid of griefers? Where, oh where, can I ship you a freebie box of clues?
@36 - their “image” only exists because we paid L$10 a pop to upload it and US$10/mo or more to fund it. And that “success” is whose? Exactly?
I think this issue clearly shows the dividing line between the 5% minority who invest hours, weeks, months, or years on top of significant amounts of cash in order to BUILD THE WORLD that $VIRTUALWORLDCO is claiming as theirs, and 95% majority who just login to be distracted, and thus have nothing to lose, because they have nothing invested.
Maybe its time to demand that $VIRTUALWORLD be acknowledged as Resident-Owned, and that the $VIRTUALWORLDCO is a service operator with a vested interest in keeping their supporters happy. Otherwise, we could just delete the content and pull out., and otherwise stop growing the “brand” for them, rather than ourselves.
April 1st, 2008 at 10:51 PM
I am curious what country Linden Lab has registered Second Life as a trademark because it is certainly not registered in the USA. If it is not registered, you have no authority to ask the public to not use these words. Is this Linden Labs attempt to try and make second life unique enough so that a court of law would make it a trademark? It per chance it is made a trademark, the use of generic words in can be contested. Now.. you could trademark “Linden Labs Second Life” but I seriously doubt that you can trademark “Second Life” and if you or have been able to, it can be contested easily.
April 1st, 2008 at 10:56 PM
I personally prefer the term Linden Laboratories, kinda makes me think that there are a bunch of Mad Scientists running around the halls of that ‘hallowed’ ground, they call HQ..
But Honestly Second Life started out so small and has grown over the years to be extremely complex. However with that in mind, sometimes a company does need to value the feed back the community around it gives back. Now many of you may notice that SL is pandering to Educational Institutions and Large Companies, focusing less on the ‘individual’ user base that once supported it. With Non for profit companies and other like minded targets, SL™ has been working hard to pull in those larger name brands and notable names to bolster itself (and its server sales/income).
Could it all be so that it can protect itself in the larger corporate world? Of course..
However people such as Blog users and tutorial websites shouldn’t be swept under the ‘Big Business’ carpet, simply because it suits Linden Lab’s new policy. SOME considerable leeway should be granted to these very same people that helped bring this very company to where it is today…Because with out their support, Linden labs would be just another failed project. Their money helped build the company up to where it is. Unless Linden Labs now thinks its it own sovereign country where it’s Tender has any actual weight without the community behind it?
April 1st, 2008 at 11:14 PM
What i can’t use my initials?
(don’t bother asking for full name but those are my initials )
April 1st, 2008 at 11:17 PM
Great you guys are protecting you brands, I am all for it, but “SL”? Come on, that is a little…no, alot…far reaching, and I as well wonder if it would actually hold up in court as long as it was 1. Obvious someone using was not part of Linden Labs or 2. Someone using it was very clear in stating that they were not part of Linden Labs. I guess http://www.slingman.com and the likes are now ON NOTICE.
Please fix the memory leak…pretty please.
April 1st, 2008 at 11:20 PM
Ok I found Second Life as a trademark but it seems that it belongs to more than one registrant. Linden Research, Inc was not the first to own it. Others can also register it for their own goods due to the common words, if I am not mistaken.
April 1st, 2008 at 11:21 PM
Typed Drawing
——————————————————————————–
Word Mark SECOND LIFE
Goods and Services IC 037. US 100 103 106. G & S: Furniture finishing and restoration. FIRST USE: 19930200. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 19940200
IC 040. US 100 103 106. G & S: custom manufacture of furniture. FIRST USE: 19930200. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 19940200
Mark Drawing Code (1) TYPED DRAWING
Serial Number 75591886
Filing Date November 19, 1998
Current Filing Basis 1A
Original Filing Basis 1B
Published for Opposition November 2, 1999
Registration Number 2311403
Registration Date January 25, 2000
Owner (REGISTRANT) Vallone, Joseph J. DBA Second Life Furniture Restoration-Custom Building INDIVIDUAL UNITED STATES 50 Terminal Street Building #1, 4th Floor Charlestown MASSACHUSETTS 02129
Attorney of Record STEVEN K. MARTIN
Type of Mark SERVICE MARK
Register PRINCIPAL
Affidavit Text SECT 15. SECT 8 (6-YR).
Live/Dead Indicator LIVE
April 1st, 2008 at 11:25 PM
Remember. Second Life wouldn’t exist if it wasn’t for us residents who create the content for it.
Whilst we do indeed need the “SL” product to create the content which has made it a success, this move by LL is like Micro$oft wanting 10% of all the profits of a book that you’ve written, because you used Word to type it up.
Whilst I haven’t used “SL” in any domain name, blog or whatever in any capacity that could confuse people that it is ‘officially endorsed’ in any way so this doesn’t really affect me personally, I very much look forward to the first ‘test cases’ appearing in court - which will most likely have as much success as the other cases.
I think LL need to take a long, hard look at itself and realise what dangerous ground it’s on. SL is Linden Lab’s ONLY product - and when either competition comes along, or there’s a major exodus due to a petty issue like this being enforced badly, then it could find itself on the verge of bankruptcy. It doesn’t make a lot of difference whether the ‘vulture capitalists’ keep throwing money at it or not - its residents, paying tier, upload fees and Lindex fees that *really* keep LL going.
Whilst there are some things I can understand you wanting to distance yourself from, perhaps you should be dealing with them on a case by case basis rather than a draconian blanket ruling that uarms far more people than it could ever benefit.
April 1st, 2008 at 11:35 PM
haha,
bad luck for slexchange, sluniverse, slcn and alot more major and minor communties with diverse orientations hooked on SL or Secondlife.
another kick in the guts of _the community_
pulling the mace of law, very destructive and distracting.
lindens will never learn.
April 1st, 2008 at 11:36 PM
I am still waiting for someone to shout, “April Fools”!
April 1st, 2008 at 11:53 PM
Dear Linden Lab,
If you do not back down on enforcing your abuse and barely legal policy against the use of “SL” and remotely try to come after all those who previously and currently use the term SL in their business entity name and or domain, I am afraid there will be repercussions in the form of an inevitable class action lawsuit against Linden Research Inc. I would regrettably take part in such a lawsuit myself.
You would be about to wage an unnecessary war with the core people who are the active force behind Second Life and made your company what it is today.
Half of creative SL residents have “SL” in their business names which was previously permitted by Linden Lab so long as non-affiliation with Linden Lab disclaimer was displayed. Such reversal on the term “SL” specifically shuts the door to the expansion of your brand rather than protect it. Your brand is Second Life, Linden Lab and the Second Life Grid, not SL. “SL” as many pointed out is a product of the residents themselves for naming Second Life.
The inSL program is fine but please don’t overstep your boundaries.
Not so long ago, Philip Rosedale Second Life talked about how he wanted to open source second life and make it available to third parties to host their own simulator and be the future virtual web. If this is the goal please explain to me how registering “SL” would leave any open door for SL to expand in a world wide scope. What are we to call the next web if not “SL”, just as we say the “web” or the “net” today.
I ask you Philip Rosedale and Members of the Board, what would we call it from here?
Please accept that it is in your best interest to keep your hands off the “SL” very seriously and please amend your trademark policy accordingly. You can still avoid a war with your customers and prevent yoursef from tarnishing your image any further under court proceedings.
Sincerely,
Anonymous Lawyer inSL
April 1st, 2008 at 11:58 PM
Trademarking 2/26ths of the English alphabet? How did you manage to swing that one past the lawyers? It’s illegal, and unconstititional. All 26 letters of the English language are fair game. Most of the letters are used in context. As long as “S” And “L” are not being used in the context of or referring to Second Life, it Can Not be trade marked as ING found out. Only the symbol and references to the company may be trade marked.
April 2nd, 2008 at 12:13 AM
Not long ago there was a Rock group that encouraged people to bring tape recorders to their concerts and then share the tapes with other fans. Then this same rock group decided to sue the pants off of people because they were sharing their music as mp3’s. This was all made possible by lobby groups representing large labels and the DMCIA.
It seems to me that LL is trying to do the same thing.
When you bite the hand that feeds you then what? If I dropped my Sl account back to free what would happen? Probley nothing in the short run or even in the long run perhaps. Because I don’t pay that much a month and really don’t even register on our account books (Unless my credit card does not clear) But Let assume that 500 people dropped their accounts would you take notice then. Again probably not. How about 5000? Or 50000. Then things would start to hurt a bit. How many people are you going to lose this month just because you can’t seem to get the servers working right or making them change a Web domain name? If all you have is large corporations footing the bill and no one around to see what they off in world then they are not going to stick around for long. it is me the little guy that in the end that really pays your bills it is because of me and others like me that make large companies want to buy in to SL.
With out us they go away.
Now you want to take away the Peoples use of the letters “SL” or the word “Second Life” How does that help you keep the little guy coming back and continuing to use the service? From my read of your policy And use of SL or Second Life not only in domain name but in any form or media is not to me used unless I am encouraging people to come and see what it is all about.
So keep on taking away from the usability of the game and its name and see how quickly you no linger have a company because the people that have come here to play a game will go away and find a different game to play. Heck thy might just start watching TV again!!! LOL
April 2nd, 2008 at 12:14 AM
so i guess it’s lawyer time, eh? what a stupid waste this is gonna be. great job linden labs.
April 2nd, 2008 at 12:22 AM
I’d like to take this opportunity to announce that I have applied for a trademark on the letters RL®™ and the word Wyald®™.
Use of either of these protected terms will result in very grumpy letters from my lawyers who will threaten to do all sorts of nasty things and think bad thoughts about you. Now, go away, you bother me.
April 2nd, 2008 at 12:25 AM
Dear Catherine Linden,
this post does not address even one of the issues raised by bloggers concerning the new trademark policy in the past days. Especially, as Kit Meredith (see her recent posts on the issue on http://kitmeredith.blogspot.com) pointed out, it does not address your censor office-like demand that we all use uncommon and stilted constructions with generic nouns appended to your brand names whenever we write about them, and the fact you try to very heavy handedly enforce these through clause 4.4 of the ToS against residents even when US law would not cover your demands (nominative use), or local legislation would make it moot (most of the rest of the world as far as I can judge).
It is, in short, useless drivel only designed to raise a smokescreen, providing a simulacrum of care while in essence openly declaring your complete and utter contempt for the people that have been your most supportive community and most successful evangelists.
Dear Catherine Linden, and dear Linden Lab all, please take not that you are driving open eyed into major PR disaster. LL is headed for the kind of fame that struck so many other companies when they abrogated themselves abusive rights on their products and terms of services. If you want to make sure your best (and may I add : unpaid) publicists and supporters turn to alternatives and declare your product unsuitable and untenable, just do go on as you do.
April 2nd, 2008 at 12:28 AM
Dear Linden Research, Inc. (TM)
After reading the entire Blog here, I am getting the same feeling that I got, after Linden Research, Inc. (TM) released the V.A.T. against EU European based residents. All hasty, nothing really thought through, very unprofessional.
I can recall that calibers like Phil Linden as well as Robin Linden announced everywhere they could how proud they are on the residents, as THEY create / created Second Life (R). So we become part of Second Life (R) an unpaid and non employed and not contracted workers of Linden Research, Inc. (TM).
No a big U-turn, rowing back, we are a part that is allowed to be there and can be happy to use the letter “S” and “L”. What I find very doubtful, if it is really possible to trademark letters or a two letter combination of an alphabet.
Also very doubtful is who has actually the right on the letters “S” and “L”, as it seems that the residents itself abbreviated Second Life (R) to SL.
I have a business running in Second Life (R), but feel constantly let down. What I foresee is that Linden Research, Inc. (TM) is preparing the ground for some business activities that will not beneficial for the end-user, the residence.
I am fully aware that Linden Reserach, Inc. (TM) is very much under pressure and has outgrown its own capacities to control Second Life (R) as a business. The move of Philip Linden is only confirming my theory.
I only hope that Linden Researc, Inc. (TM) is coming to its senses and begins to re-think its activities.
April 2nd, 2008 at 12:32 AM
Everyone knows that SL means “Simulated Lands” so I really don’t see where there’s going to be any problem here.
For instance, SLExchange is for buying/selling stuff for Simulated Lands…though I do notice that their listings do seem to be rather heavy in items intended for use in the Linden Lab® Second Life®™© virtual world, but I’m sure that’s just a coincidence and shouldn’t be a problem at all.
April 2nd, 2008 at 12:56 AM
[...] Traducido de blog.secondlife.com [...]
April 2nd, 2008 at 12:57 AM
Sonny laughs at LL……………like to see this hold up in a european court…………
oh and BTW take a leaf out of SIDEWINDERS book…………….and post blog responses………
Unbelievable how you treat the community.
Sonny goes off to find sidewinder and give him a big kiss for being the only decent employee of Linden Labs
April 2nd, 2008 at 12:58 AM
We’re taking steps to improve our copyright claim process and will saying more about that soon.”
This is the best part of your post, but please be fast in your improvements before things turn for the worst.
As for implementing this new scheme, please consider something that is WIN-WIN. We understand your need to protect your brand and reputation, and I applaud you in taking steps to do so, but the new set of policies need some more tweaking.
April 2nd, 2008 at 1:00 AM
Conversation goes like this -
Mr Google: So Phil there’s all this talk of us buying you out. What exactly do we get if we do that?
Phil Rosedale: Well dude you get all our hardware, software, our brilliant employees and this well established brand including distinctive eye-in-hand-logo.
Mr Google: You know Phil I read some resident websites and they made out like your hardware keeps failing, your employees only work on stuff that gives them a feel good factor and things like asset servers and money transactions keep breaking, thereby hurting the SL™ business community.
Phil Rosedale: Ummm yeah but the server code, the viewer.
Mr Google: I get what your saying but thats already all open source, I happen to have fields of servers and some of the best developers in the world at my disposal.
Pjil Rosedale: Ummm we have this distinctive eye-in-hand log ™
Mr Google: Would fifty bucks do?
It reads like a seen from Monkey Island™ at the Scumm Bar™
April 2nd, 2008 at 1:05 AM
@ 80 Tamasin…………….ROFLMAO………….
Now that Lindens is what i call putting it in a nutshell……….thats why we have no blog responses………to bad tamasin overheard the conversation………..
hahahahahahahah
April 2nd, 2008 at 1:11 AM
Yes, this is all part of their build up to an IPO hoping to sell stock to people who’ve never actually tried to spend time in Second Life (insert all appropriate trademarks and legal disclaimers as needed) or to make their company more attractive to a potential buy out (”see we have this wonderful virtual world that’s unstable as hell and can’t be fixed without a total rebuild from the ground up. However, we have this intellectual property including a lock on the initials SL… that’s where our REAL value is.”
You’re really concerned that someone might fool people into thinking they were you? HAH! The way the grid has been lately, the LAST company I’d want my company to be associated with is Linden Labs.
I love Second Life (insert all appropriate, blah blah blah) and in my Pollyannic mental state, keep HOPING that some day the grid will be stable.
Then again, I keep hoping that the New Orleans Saints will win a Super Bowl and that the Chicago Cubs will win the World Series.
April 2nd, 2008 at 1:31 AM
[...] Linden Lab have further clarified their policy and there’s certainly so sign of them resiling from their initial stance. One aspect that [...]
April 2nd, 2008 at 1:39 AM
I run on the first and foremost SL blog in my country. Althought its name is GETA, at the time when i choose its domain name only a few Portuguese people were in SL, so I made clear that it was a blog about SL, choosing that domain, since its was allowed as a fan site. This is a blog *in portuguese* that helps a lot of people that can’t get things translated, it has been mentioned on a lot of places, including the main media in my country. I will not change domain, or I will loose pagerank, links, etc. Blogging is about fun and enjoying writting. When it becomes a bother and a pain, its time to close. So I guess, either you start thinking about allowing official fan sites, or I will wait for the letter.
April 2nd, 2008 at 1:50 AM
@59 Allen Kerensky: Good points, couldn’t have said it better
@Linden Lab(tm)(r)(wtf)(cya): Good luck with your witch hunt
@Catherine Linden(tm)(r)(wtf)(cya): You can’t post and run, without destroying your image. Answer the questions.
I’m sure you can all relax. LL(tm)(r)(wtf)(cya) lawyers has no case here. Let them take this battle to court, and make themselves look like april fools
April 2nd, 2008 at 1:54 AM
catherine, no chance to get a
“hey bloggers, nobody will SUE you for blog heade